Some thoughts..

Panthau · February 24th, 2010, 12:00

Hi,

I just wondered how Eckhart Tolle´s teachings and the LOA fit together.

On the one hand, theres the possibility to raise oneself above thinking, staying in the now and connect to the beeing he is. Eckhart says "its not about asking what you want from life, but what life wants from you", and i think he means what your greater beeing wants to experience. So staying in the now, means being lead by the "source".

The LOA on the other hand, means to take control of ones thoughts and create the life that you wish (so asking life what YOU want from it, when youre not woken up yet).

But when you´re alreay woken up (enlightened), you can of course still use your thoughts and the LOA, but probably theres no reason anymore.

So what comes first for someone that wants to wake up? The LOA which leads to no-LOA? Or is the LOA still to be used when the mind has lost its importance?

Maybe someone knows more

Pan

Still Waters · February 24th, 2010, 18:50

Hi Pan. How are you?

The law of attraction however wonderful is often misunderstood and mistaught. It is not really about saying I will go for this that and the other and then try to manifest it. The Universe will only respond if that which we are attempting to manifest fits in with our purpose and passions. Often when you set goals or form affirmations, there is often a feeling of uneasiness. This is because what we are seeking is not right for us. The universe has amazing things for each one of us but they are individual and unique. Not everyone is going to be an entrepreneur like Richard Branson. It may be that you find your place by being an author instead or a spiritual teacher or whatever.

Therefore I believe that the teachings of Tolle are not in opposition to the Law of Attraction in its purest form. This is because a person who is beginning to experience an awakening is more likely to be aware of their place in the universe and what is right at any particular point of their development. It is a matter of living in the flow, or as Tolle puts it - accepting what is.

Of course the timing of the Universe is not the same as our timing. It may be a while before we see the manifestation of our goals. We may have things to learn on the journey and when it arrives it may not be in the way we expect or envisioned it to be

In the meantime it is important to continue to be grateful for what we have and what we are becoming, to guard our thoughts and emotions, to live in the moment, to know that all things will work to our good, and that we will be provided for by a benevolent and abundant Universe.

Hope that helps and I am sure others will soon be along with their own take.

Chris

testdaffodil · February 24th, 2010, 21:03

I've read Paul bailey's "Think of an elephant" where he says LOA has 4 parts
1.psychological attitide
2.Mind body connection
3.Our connection to society & natural environment
4.Our connection between psyche and the infinity of original reality ( being)
All 4 has to be in alignment for and harmony for LOA to work for us.from what i understand,Our mind directs our body influencing mind body connection through powerful components of imagination and visualization.Our spiritual task is to balance the three parts with ( psychological attitude) power of positive thinking .
because we are separated from the whole we gain momentum through aligning the 4 parts of LOA to reawaken our dorment connection to the highest level of spiritual consciousness and integrate into the infinite devine whole (being) through meditation .i guess being able to integrate into infinite whole is reaching an enligntened state.
Again we are different individuals eventhough one at core , we have our own learning journey to take and purpose to fulfill therefore we are all at our different individual spiritual levels .May be LOA to result (awakening ) for someone wanting to wake up .I don't think mind ever looses it's importance rather the real you/enlightened you uses it for positive visualization for wider contribution in creating a peaceful aligned world in perfect harmony hence enlightened people have greater reason to use LOA.
i hope i don't confuse you.
testdaffodil

Itlandm · February 24th, 2010, 21:14

This looks like a good place to say that I consider the "Law of Attraction" to be oddly named, to say the least.

Do I want to attract wealth? I want to create wealth, and share it with those around me. Not necessarily on a large scale, but necessarily in that direction.

Do I want to attract happiness? I want to give happiness to others, steadily increasing the happiness in the world.

Do I want to attract love? I want to radiate love and compassion like a fireplace on a cold evening. To be loved is incidental, to love is essential.

To me "the Law of Attraction" sounds pretty bad, like some kind of black hole, or at best a kind of magnet drawing things from around you. I am surprised people can use it with a straight face. We live to give, people! If we are not going to increase the happiness of others, who will? The ignorant, the bitter, the envious, the cynical, the depressed, those who have given up hope? We are the ones they have been waiting for, right?

I guess it boils down to the notion that "attraction" means we want to get something from others. What we want, however, is "manifestation". Or even, if I dare say it, "creation".

Panthau · February 24th, 2010, 23:00

Some interesting points here. I can follow you daffodil and Still Waters, it makes sense
what you are saying. Seeing it that way, id say it makes sense to recognize what one is
thinking, to get aware of all the negative thoughts. But is it nessecary to manifest something actively? Isnt that done by itself when we align those 4 points? Wouldnt manifesting our free will lead to even more confusion? This may of course be different for
woken up people.

Itlandm, i see your point. Maybe its just confusion of words, because the loa itself doesnt
create, gives or does anything by itself, if i understood it right... its just a law of how our mind works.

Itlandm · February 25th, 2010, 03:00

But the thing is, our mind does not actually work that way. Thinking of the things you want (as in want to be given, or in other words, the things you desire) will cause a feeling of poverty. Desire is always a negative position. If you were not in a negative position, you would not wish to draw in something from your environment, just as water does not flow into a wellspring, but flows into a drain.

Thinking about giving and sharing, on the other hand, is a positive position. This will cause good things to happen regularly.

Therefore there is no conflict between selflessness and happiness. It is not like you can choose between them. That is an illusion. You can choose to chase selfish desires, but their enjoyment is like the proverbial food in Hell: The more you eat, the hungrier you become.

Gratitude and love are positive, overflowing positions. Envy and desire are negative, sucking positions. It should be clear to all which of these will cause good things to manifest.

Bhavya · February 25th, 2010, 03:03

Originally Posted by Panthau

I just wondered how Eckhart Tolle´s teachings and the LOA fit together.

Pan I think this is a really good question. It's the one that 30 years ago motivated me to branch out from insight meditation (mindfulness). I felt that there was so much suffering both in and around me, it seemed unbearable to just accept all of that without trying to make changes through the power of attraction, prayer etcetera. Now I realise that accepting reality in all its forms is itself a powerful way to achieve change - that awareness of our mental impurities necessarily motivates us to purify ourselves of the poisonous habits which have been attracting all we don't want into our lives.

So you're right, the LOA is simply a law - it's how the universe works and the more we share peace and love and practice generosity, the more those aspects will show up in our lives. If we reach the fullness of enlightenment and know our Oneness with All on an ongoing basis, life will live itself through us. Our power to act will be in the service of Good. Personal desires will fall away because we're no longer identified with our egos which are merely tools used to live in the world of duality and serve all beings. Mooji, Amma, and other teachers I have known are all extraordinarily humble, living very simply. And the power of their vibrations are extraordinarily uplifting.

Pan, it's wonderful to see you doing so well

Love and blessings to you all
May we all reach the highest!!!!!!!!
Bhavya

chris-da-fur · February 25th, 2010, 03:44

"If we reach the fullness of enlightenment and know our Oneness with All on an ongoing basis, life will live itself through us"

Shouldn't it be "when"?

pollyanna · February 25th, 2010, 13:58

Usually I steer clear of the deeper questions in the community because as someone asked Alice "How deep down the rabbit hole do you want to go?"

As Bhavya has stated, it is a really good question Pan - here's my simple understanding on these powerful issues...

We are spiritual beings (or part of a spiritual being) experiencing a human existance - the question is why? are we just playing or do we have a purpose?

Meditation allows us to observe our belief systems and habits and let go of those that do not serve us or others well, creating the space to understand and have compassion for others and ourself. It frees us up to allow the space for insights to do good and serve others well.

The law of attraction, law of the universe or whatever name we call this, is I believe, a very powerful law also, as in - thoughts become things - you bring about what you think about and focus upon and the busy mind is always focusing on things (you become aware of this when you first begin meditating) Just becoming aware of your busy mind is a great step forward because you then realise you have CHOICES

The stillness within is, has and always will be there.

The law of attraction works for whatever you focus, feel and act on - love, kindness, gratitude, abundance, fear, worry, it makes no difference.

Some people want to have this and have that but maybe don't know why they want it really and I don't think this is fruitful.

I believe that if you are responsible, value others and yourself, become the best you can be, do the things you need to do to have the life you choose to live you will truly value the outcome.

Back to the statement - We are spiritual beings (or part of a spiritual being) experiencing a human existance - the question is why? are we just playing or do we have a purpose?

To have a purpose and leave this human experience having made a contribution and difference to others is a worthwhile cause - if we're just playing, then experience love, joy, fun and abundance.

I hope this makes some kind of sense and wish you continued peace and joy

Bhavya · February 25th, 2010, 15:21

Originally Posted by chris-da-fur

"If we reach the fullness of enlightenment and know our Oneness with All on an ongoing basis, life will live itself through us"

Shouldn't it be "when"?

Quite right. It should be "when"
Pollyanna, you sum it up beautifully.
I like the way that everyone has explained their point of view to give different aspects of this. Good stuff