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I'm confused on what meditation to pick

Discussion in 'Meditation Chatter Box' started by arvindautar, May 20, 2009.

  1. arvindautar

    arvindautar Member

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    I have science of enlightenment by Shinzen Young, it contains of 6 meditations. Each 45 min aprox. After I have done them all through the day i get that woo-woo spacy feeling and I don't know but i don't like that feeling.

    I read at project-meditation.org that there would be several meditations and there are each listed with several benefits, which confuses me even more. Is it just a flavor you pick? I'm asking this because i read on Wikipedia that all meditations have the same end result.

    my main aim is order on hirarchie :
    - being fully present when i consciously chose to
    - grounded ( moving from that center of gravity )
    - potency, - internal power-
    - clarity of mind
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2009
  2. arvindautar

    arvindautar Member

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    i forget to mention th shinzen young has the following meditations:

    - 07: Meditation / Global relaxation
    - 08: Meditation / Free-floating awareness in the body
    - 11: Meditation / The thinking process
    - 12: Meditation / Clarifying the sense of Self
    - 19: Meditation / Expanding and contracting with the breath
    - 20: Meditation / Covering the whole sensory field
     
  3. Scheezo

    Scheezo Member

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    I'm new to this so I don't have many answers but 6 45 minute meditations? 4 1/2 hours of meditating? Somewhere in the discover meditation program is says you shouldn't meditate too much at first.
     
  4. pollyanna

    pollyanna Moderator

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    Hi Arvindauter, Discover Meditation (the free course) is an excellent way to learn to meditate. A number of people in the community say they paid thousands to learn the same.

    There are about 20 guided meditations to help you in various areas in your life that you may choose to focus on at some time, however, these do not replace your real meditation time.

    For example you may choose to meditate for 20/40 or 60 minutes each day.

    You may be wanting to experience a better spiritual connection, therefore outside of your regular meditation time, you could simply play the guided meditation for a better spiritual connection while you're sitting or lay down, relaxing with your eyes closed, allowing you to visualize.

    If you enjoy meditation, you can play LifeFlow, whilst you meditate and allow LifeFlow to take you to various specific brainwaves perfect for meditation.

    I hope this helps you - reading some of the Golden Threads (click on the button at the top of the community) will reveal some great info for you also. I wish you peace and joy on your journey :) :) :)

    P.S. Be aware that meditation is meditation and the benefits achieved from regular practise are many. LifeFlow speeds this process up dramatically and is a wonderful aid. I see many products out there that say this one builds relationships, this one cures hayfever or this one takes you to planet zod :confused: There are so many marketing ploys out there.

    You can become present and aware by quietly going within to the wonderful stillness within each of us - it just takes a little regular practise. :)
     
  5. GilesC

    GilesC Member

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    The first meditation workshop I ever did was a whole day event practicing all different sorts of meditation including contemplative, chanting, walking meditation, mantra meditation etc. At the end of the day I too was feeling completely spaced out. Nice feeling though. :D

    Sometimes it is just a case that we resist that which we are not familiar with. We are attached to what we know and anything that varies from that can create a fear within us. Often, if we ignore that fear and just "go for it" we find it's nothing to be fearful of after all.

    However, I agree that typically, when we first start to meditate it is best to start with shorter meditations and progress up to a desired limit e.g. 20minutes each time, twice a day. (or 40 minutes if you're using lifeflow downloads)

    As for all meditations providing the same end result... hmmm... not so sure about that. I wouldn't necessarily believe everything you read on wikipedia, especially as it is written by the general public and not necessarily good authorities on the subject. I consider there to be 3 main types of meditation... objective, contemplative and mantra based. Each of these can be used for different purposes and, I believe, will provide different benefits.

    Hugs

    Giles
     
  6. arvindautar

    arvindautar Member

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    Yes, I also read that Vipassana meditation is 10 days straight! Even for newbies like me. I'm thinking of doing such a course, but right now I want to pick the right meditations for my goals.

    yes! that's why i was so confused when i read project-meditation, that mindfulness is for health, Vipassana to see things clearly. I would appreciate if someone could help me out on selecting the right kind of meditations that fit my goals.

    as for the guided meditations on the website, I download and listened to them. Realtivly short, but perhaps I could give them another shot. Altough the given descriptions... I don't know which one fit my goals exactly

    also that mantra meditation, I did a bit of research on the meanings of those words and what they could possibly bring for benefit (Benefits | The Transcendental Meditation (TM) Program - Official Website ). I found two things, one thing about some guy that asked a lot of money for these mantra's and on some website with great benefits. However asking so much money for a mantra makes me a bit ... i think it makes me feel like I'm not completely trusting it

    thank you
     
  7. GilesC

    GilesC Member

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    In short I would summarise as follows:

    Objective meditation:
    A focus on a particular object e.g. the breath, candle flame, soundtrack (e.g. meditation bells) etc.
    This can bring great peace and relaxation, but can prevent the mind from reaching a deep state as it is being held in the conscious mind of thought.

    Contemplative meditation:
    Usually providing a scene or scenario to start the meditation (as a guided meditation or a question in the meditators mind), which the meditator focus' on and follows the thoughts with a view to achieving a desired outcome or answer to a question.
    This can be useful for accessing intuitive knowledge or memories and also be relaxing, but again keeps the focus in the conscious mind of thoughts.

    Mantra meditation:
    As brought to the West by the Transcendental Meditation (TM) movement of the 1960's. The Mantra is started in the mind and allowed to BE there in it's own way, repeating over and over. The meditator simply observes the mantra, recognising when the thoughts have arisen, letting those thoughts go and inviting the mantra back again.
    This type of meditation allows for the meditator to go beneath the conscious mind of thoughts and come back to their True Self (a place where time is non-existent and attachment to the physical world is not recognised etc.) It is difficult to describe the state this reaches when using words. Some call it ultimate bliss, some enlightenment, some ultimate peace. It is all those things and more. Most meditators of this form, get occasional moments of this state of deep BEing, but it takes continued practice to remain there. It can also help with bringing about a state of presence when not meditating.

    Absolutely agree that Mantra meditation such as TM seems to be expensive. The cost is why some TM teachers have broken away from the TM organisation and set up their own TM style workshops under a different name so that it can be made more available to the general populous at a reasonable price. However, we also have Michael here on Project Meditation who provides the very same teaching for free (albeit not on a 1 to 1 personal basis). Some of the schools of TM type teachings give a mantra to their students, charge a lot of money, and say that the mantra is personal to them and specially chosen for them. Truth is that TM (to the best of my knowledge at this time of writing) has 16 mantras it gives to it's students, and the one selected is based on the age of the student at the time they learn TM. When TM first came to the West there were just two mantra used, one for male and one for female.

    So, certainly, mantra meditations area available and should be available to all, and yes, some of those teaching are prohibitively expensive. People like to think they are getting something special because they have paid a lot. In truth they get little more than what Michael provides here for free.

    Interestingly, David Lynch (director/writer of Twin Peaks fame and other wonderful films) finds all his creativity comes from meditating with TM. He has even set up an organisation (Transcendental Meditation : Education : David Lynch Foundation) to try and get meditation taught to more people around the world, especially in schools etc.

    I personally, do all the types of meditation as need requires, except mantra meditation which I do twice a day regardless, as well as other practices for being present throughout the day.

    Hugs

    Giles
     
  8. sliccy

    sliccy Member

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    Wow Giles, your knowledge in these subjects never ceases to amaze me. You're wonderful, thank you so much for sharing it is always insightful to learn more about meditation. Especially when it's so simplified, as you have just demonstrated.

    BTW I've been secretly spending a lot of time on your personal website, Giles. I just wanted to thank you for all the great information you have on there. It has certainly triggered me to look into Reiki and EFT in greater depth.


    Andy
     
  9. seatrend8899

    seatrend8899 Member

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    GileC's Web Site

    Hey Andy,
    Thanks for that post...I did not realize Gile had such a cool web site! His software programming side seems to blend into this abit as well.:)

    Now I have a chance to read up on EFT from Giles perspective "before" I try to digest the pile of EFT emails from Gary Craig.:)


    shine on all

    jim
     
  10. GilesC

    GilesC Member

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    Thanks for the compliments. Gratefully accepted.

    The website is still incomplete. I guess I should works some more on it and spend less time on forums hehe! (Bit difficult when your also a moderator on 3 of them)

    ;)

    Hugs

    Giles
     
  11. arvindautar

    arvindautar Member

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    Ok, i quit the mindfulness meditation for about a week now and am only doing holosync ( awakening prologue). I borrowed this set from my friend with the intent on doing it together with the mindfulness meditation. I dropped the mindfulness meditation for a week or so now . Today the following happened

    1) On my way to the job interview I got lost and I asked a view people. One of those people said to me ( while explaining ) .. "Hello, are you still there ?!?"

    2) During my job interview, i zoned out and the women looked strangely at me and she said "Are you okay you seem _absent_"

    3) I went out to dinner with my mom, paps, sister and aunt. My mom kept on saying : "What's wrong with you? You seem so inattentive.... what's wrong with you". She said this multiply times.

    So from now on I'm going to drop the mindfulness meditation and holosync. Until i get the information I needed to continue. I feel disappointed and upset. :(

    Now, having said this. Please forgive me for repeating myself.

    Ok, this is all I want. How can I do this, what are the exact steps for me to take?

    - Arvind
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2009
  12. Edwin

    Edwin Member

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    Arvind, when reading your problems with "zoning out" what comes to mind with me is that you might have stretched your efforts a bit too far, going at it with serious willpower and effort...

    Which is, I am sorry to say, a beginner's mistake ( I am this sure because I have been down that road ) and can be very challenging on your concentration.
    You literally might have exhausted your brain.
    Meditation and awareness are just as much skills as running a marathon: you have to train and build up your training, you can't run the marathon on the first day of training.

    My advice is also the answer to your question:
    http://www.project-meditation.org/c...rack-project-meditation-success.html#post1333

    And finally some tips:
    - Take it easy.
    You have all the time in the world. It might not seem like it now, but after committing yourself to about 3 or 4 months of regular meditation ( regular meaning at least once, and preferrably twice a day for a maximum of 20 minutes a session ) you will feel more relaxed and centered.
    - Don't over-meditate
    Another one of those traps we fall in when we start. It feels so good we want to meditate more and more. However, meditation is very powerful on the mind. Recent research proves that long term meditators have actually changed the physical structure of the brain, especially around the emotion part. This process can bring up unresolved memories and emotions that can be quite an overload when you haven't yet learned how to let them go yet.
    - Don't try too hard
    Meditation has to be relaxing in order to work. The endresult of meditation is to quiet the mind, I know, but people that jus start think that they can achieve that right away by "willing" it away. That unfortunately can be achieved for some time this way, but has nothing to do with meditation. meditation has to be effortless if you want to reach the deeper brainwaves.

    I wish you wonderful meditation sessions :)
     
  13. arvindautar

    arvindautar Member

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    hi edwin,

    Thank you for that link and reassurance! Last question: can I use holosync in combination with lifeflow? I will cut down the regular meditation to just one and focus more externally( more exercise ) so i can balance more properly, I think this what they mean with grounding )


    A friend of mine just wrote me this. He said basically said:

    I remember going through a phase that I felt spaced out too. Whats happening is, Holosync is forcing your brain through a restructuring process, aka your subconscious and conscious mind are wiring together and balancing. This is actually a good thing, although it might seem strange at first. Being spaced out means you're brain is operating in Alpha, if you were focused and attentive that would be Beta.

    Many brainwave scientists, as well as spiritual / success gurus have proven that Alpha is the best frequency to be at, because its the frequency where your whole mind is balanced and working together. Beta is good for focus, but when youre in Beta, you cant access all of your mental capacities.

    It may be the case that when you're "too" spaced out, youre operating at low Alpha, just above the threshold of Theta, or even in Theta itself, which is where deeper meditation and mental capacities come in. I've been in Theta while doing tasks, it felt like I was half asleep (but I wasnt physically tired).

    If you feel you need to make a change, instead of quitting, try going back to an earlier level of Holosync for a week or two. If you're on Level 1, go back to Prologue. If on Level 2, go to Level 1. Holosync always told me (through emails) this was the best thing to do if you start feeling strange.

    If you quit now, your mind will be left at the brink of a very important shift. At least try going back to an earlier level for about a week, you should notice better results.

    But overall, you should expect some new and strange things with practicing brainwave entrainment. The ride can sometimes be bumpy, there were times I felt my entire reality was ripping apart at the seams (very crazy stuff!) but I kept pushing through and I got through it, and now I am reaping many great rewards because of it. I can command almost any brainwave frequency at command, going into alpha or theta by just using my will alone.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2009
  14. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    I would not recommend mixing the two at this stage. I used both of them on the same day while they were both fairly new to me, and had two rather freakish nightmares, one the same night and one two nights later. So, I advise against it. Given that you already experience personality changes from Holosync, I don't think you should tempt fate even more. Wait until your brain has adjusted.
     
  15. Edwin

    Edwin Member

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    As you might have seen in the forums, there is a holosync reseller that thought it nessecary to slash at PM.
    I think it is cheap to slash back, so I won't be tempted to do that.

    Try either LF or HS seperately for a month, and see which one works better. Don't try them at the same time, as LF and HS are structurally different from each other.
     
  16. seatrend8899

    seatrend8899 Member

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    Holosync "Dive" vs first LifeFlow levels

    Hello All,
    I would like to make an observation from a newbie to LifeFlow whom has not had the opportunity to try any Holosync material. LifeFlow is a graduated entrainment approach that entrains from brainwave ranges of alpha then theta then delta. Once the lowest level of delta is reached LifeFlow provides two free gamma tracks for the user. The gamma tracks should only be used if one has worked their way through the complete Lifeflow track series.

    If one was involved in a "bake-off" between the two products one needs to keep in mind that the first three levels of LifeFlow takes you into alpha exclusively yet the first level of Holosync via "The Dive" takes one via ramp down first to a theta brainwave value (without ramp and hold on alpha as Holosync does not believe alpha requires any entrainment due to the proximity of these brainwave lengths to the "awake state" of beta brainwave lengths) then ramps down to a delta brainwave value. As stated by Centerpointe (Holosync company name) the time to reach delta via "The Dive" is 24 minutes. After "The Dive" the user is instructed to "change the CD" to "Immersion" thus allowing the user to be exposed to a constant delta brainwave entainment since their brain is now "conditioned" via "The Dive".

    After a certain number of weeks (6 weeks?) the user then replaces the "Immersion" with the next "deeper version" of "Immersion" repeating this mode till the series of "Immersion" CDs for that Holosync CD package is completed.

    Just as an observation, I believe any one comparing Lifeflow to Holosync would have a difficult task indeed due to the totally different approachs that these products use.

    it just seems that the sensation of "something is happening" would certainly be in favour of Holosync just due to the vast range of entrainment wave length exposure and the body sensations that may result.


    just a thought



    shine on

    jim
     
  17. sliccy

    sliccy Member

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    Giles (or anyone else who might have the answer),

    Where would LifeFlow mediation fall under of the three categories? If I had to make a guess it'd be a combination of Objective and Mantra meditation.


    Andy
     
  18. GilesC

    GilesC Member

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    The base meditation technique provided in the "Discover Meditation" download is the Mantra based meditation. Typically with this meditation technique people will start out focused on the mantra as an object, but with practice we learn to let the mantra just BE there and let go of the focus taking us deeper below the conscious mind.

    If I'm right (please correct me if I'm not) there's a gratitude exercise on that download too (I really should listen to the whole lot *shame on me*), which may be a form of objective meditation. There are then all the downloadable guided meditations which are obviously contemplative meditations.

    When I get a moment I'll go back and have a full listen to Michaels "discover meditation" download to confirm. I only really listened to the first parts which just confirmed for me it was mantra meditation like I already do.

    Hugs

    Giles
     

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