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After years on holosync should I change

Discussion in 'START HERE: Registration & Introductions' started by naturaltrust, May 13, 2009.

  1. naturaltrust

    naturaltrust Member

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    I have been using holosync for several years now and I am currently commencing Purification Level 2. Can anyone tell me if I should commence Life flow and at what level?
     
  2. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    I will not presume to tell you what to do with your life and money, but it seems almost too much of a coincidence that I just a couple hours ago got a comment on my personal blog from someone who had just begun to combine the two techniques after 5 years of happy Holosyncing. He says, "Now, I have just started using LF during my afternoon meditation (HS always 1st thing in morning), so far Ive found I have more energy and am somewhat more focused on things (work) then before using it." So evidently it can be done without exploding your brain. :)

    The two systems are so different that you would probably want to start from the beginning. LifeFlow uses different target frequencies while Holosync uses different carrier frequencies. Also, LF is more of a gradually expanding tool box. Look around a bit in the forum and you will see people who have used LF for years and still return to the first tracks.
     
  3. Ta-tsu-wa

    Ta-tsu-wa Member

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    Natural

    If you intend to combine both tools so that one enhances the other then you'll probably want to match up entrainment frequencies between the respective tracks so as not to mix apples and oranges. Two ways to do this suggest themselves.

    Each LF track has a number at the end of its name that specifies its specific entrainment frequency so you always know exactly what the intended entrainment effect of that track is on your brainwaves.

    If you want to jump into the LF system at the corresponding level of Holosync you're currently using, what is the precise entrainment frequency of this Purification Level 2 track? Pick the level of LF track that exactly matches it and work with those two tracks.

    On the other hand, it seems like a waste to pay full cost for the entire LF series and then only use a couple of the tracks. Maybe you want to start from the beginning and get the benefits of all the tracks. Since the LF-10 track targets the 10Hz frequency, what Holosync track do you have that also focuses on 10Hz? Pick that track and use it in conjunction with LF-10 as your starting point. Work your way down through the full LF series, cross matching frequencies between them and your Holosync tracks as you go.

    Another way to approach it would be to pick tracks between the two systems that have complimentary "harmonic" frequencies, meaning that the frequency in the LF track would be an exact multiple of the frequency of the Holosync track you're using, or vice-a-versa.

    So for instance, if you start with the LF-10 track you could use a complimentary track of Holosync that entrains to either 5Hz (2 x HS-5 = LF-10) or 20Hz (LF-10 x 2 = HS-20). Or you could match up the LF-9 track with a Holosync track that entrains to 3Hz (3 x 3 = 9) and so forth.

    Combining tracks using either the exact matching, or the complimentary/harmonic method would be worth trying to see what results it produces.

    Another possibility, especially if your finances are a little tight, would be to use only the LF tracks for a few months without any Holosync. That way you would have a good basis to assess how effective they are compared to the Holosync you're already familiar with. Many people on this forum have come from using Holosync to the LF tracks and report the results with LF are much more significant and positive. If that turns out to be the case for you as well you might just decide to stick exclusively with the LF system, particularly in light of the fact that it costs only a fraction of the price as compared to Holosync.

    How ever you go at it, be sure to post your results here. It's always interesting to hear how people who have used both systems compare the two.
     
  4. Edwin

    Edwin Member

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    Well put Ta-Tsu-Wa !

    I don't know if you plan to pay for the entire LF series all at once, you might want to try the first LifeFlow Tracks and if it's not for you, you can end the subscribtion. But my personal experience is that this will probably not be the case. :)

    Do try it with meditation tho ! A lot of holo-sync users try LifeFlow by simply listening to it, and it does have some benefits, but LifeFlow is specifically made to enhance meditation ( hence the name of this website ).

    You can try the excellent meditation course on this site ( it's free )
     
  5. WeeHoo

    WeeHoo Member

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    I used Holosync (although not nearly as long as you) but switched exclusively to LifeFlow because the difference was so remarkable. I've changed more in five months of LF meditation than in well over a year of HoloSync. My family notices a huge difference in me, and I notice a huge difference in me. My money's on LF. Although I have to say--Bill Harris cranks out some incredibly informative support material. He also, of course, cranks out a lot of really obnoxious stuff, but the scientific materials he makes available have been extremely useful to me.
     
  6. freedomguru

    freedomguru New Member

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    How do you determine which HS correspond to the which LF level. I am finished with Purification level 2 what would be the corresponding LF level?

    Thanks
     
  7. Edwin

    Edwin Member

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    That is kind of like saying:

    I have finished about half the apple, I now want to switch to pear, how much of the pear can I skip ?

    They are two different ways of approaching the technique that is generally referred to as "entrainment".

    Start with LF 10. Really !
    You will be amazed by what it can do to you. Even if you will have covered the same range within Holosync, LifeFlow operates differently.

    This has been confirmed by loads of holosync users that allready made the switch the last couple of years.
     
  8. Ta-tsu-wa

    Ta-tsu-wa Member

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    How to determine Holosync entrainment frequencies

    You're asking your question on the wrong forum. Lifeflow gives you the frequency the tracks use right in the track name. So that information you already have.

    You want to know what the entrainment frequency is for the Holosync program, Purifucation level 2. For that you need to ask Holosync, as they do not provide any such information in their sales literature.

    It's a little surprising, actually, since the basic frequency of an entrainment track is not any sort of "trade secret". Their processing methods which they say are proprietary, yes, it's understandable they wouldn't want to release details about that. But simply informing the customer what frequency they'll be entraining their brain to? Your Purification level 2 sounds a little like a line from the movie Forrest Gump. To paraphrase: "It's like a box of chocolates; you never know what you're gonna get." It's similar to buying canned goods in unmarked cans with no labels on them. What's inside? Nobody knows.

    If you somehow do obtain that information from their customer service department please post it here as I'm sure there are many people who would be curious to know the answer.

    You asked another question in a separate post about the depth of the carrier waves. The standard Lifeflow carrier frequencies are several times lower than even the lowest carrier used by Holosync (Holosync does tell you what that is on their website.) The precise numbers for comparison were posted already on this forum here:

    http://www.project-meditation.org/c...low-does-carrier-frequencies-go.html#post3743

    I agree with Edwin in that these two products are apples and oranges. Have a look at some of the many posts from former Holosync users who have switched to using Lifeflow. Sorry, I'm not one who has ever used much Holosync, so I can't speak from direct experience, but many forum members here have and speak quite openly about the difference. One forum member called "NewYorker" has written quite a few posts pointing out the difference in his experience. Search for all posts with his name and you'll get some very informed, first hand opinions.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2009
  9. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    I use both of the technologies and I have some information that may be useful.

    Each LF track consists only of one frequency. The name of the track gives the frequency as a whole number in Herz. For instance, the first is LF10, in the alpha range. The lowest is 1, in the low delta range.

    In contrast, each session with Holosync has at least 3 different frequencies, 4 after you have finished the Awakening Prologue. The Dive contains three different stages: One alpha, one theta and one delta. They take up roughly 10 minutes each, and the idea is to gradually step you down to the delta level. Since the brain uses some time to home in on a new frequency (up to 8 minutes), very little time is spent actually entrained to these. The second track, Immersion, is always delta. Lower frequencies of delta become available at certain points in the program. If you have reached these, the information should be included with the extra CDs you switch to. (For the first weeks after you start a new level, you use an Immersion with the same frequency as the last ten minutes of the Dive.)

    As you can see, the approach is very different.
     
  10. seatrend8899

    seatrend8899 Member

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    question......

    Hi Itlandm,
    From what I read on the Holosync site one must listen to the Dive CD prior to the Immersion as it is stated that "ramping" is required to prepare one for the "straight delta" of the Immersion CD.
    Would not the requirement to change your CD from "Dive" to "Immersion" negate any "ramping" to delta action? In other words how is the "ramping benefit" retained after this physical action of changing the CD?


    thanks in advance for any feedback


    shine on

    jim
     
  11. Edwin

    Edwin Member

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    I am wondering as well:

    When I start painting or writing a poem, certain parts of my brain will automatically, without any effort switch to Delta.

    Not the whole brain, just certain parts of the brain.
    When engaged in other activities, other parts of the brain will switch to Delta.
    The brain doesn't "ramp", it just slows down certain parts, all by itself, within seconds. Advanced meditators who have never used entrainment products, just 30 or more years of meditation will switch to a deep meditative state within seconds, this has been proven with numerous research projects.

    What proof is there that the mind needs ramping anyway ?
    Wouldn't this be if the brainstate that is aimed for is an unnatural state, instead of the normal states that are aimed for now ?

    When in deep sleep, the mind goes through all cycles of brainwaves, without any help ! The ramping doesn't occur in entrainment products, it happens all by itself in your brain ! Why do we need ramping in an entrainment product then ?
     
  12. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    Well, there is ramping and there is ramping.

    Ramping with a movable target is unlikely to work (apart from the placebo effect, which is no small thing in itself). The brain uses minutes, not moments, to latch on to an unfamiliar frequency.

    Ramping in stages, however, is actually very much like what the brain does during the natural sleep cycle. It spends some minutes in alpha, then several more minutes in theta before it moves down to delta. There is surely some benefit to this in the case of natural sleep. Whether there is any benefit to it when using brainwave entrainment is less certain, but in the case of Holosync that's all the alpha and theta they get in the main program. (They have their own learning and creativity track, plus a longevity track with theta and affirmations, but these are strictly optional.)

    Ramping is NOT necessary to enter delta when you use entrainment. This also holds true for Holosync's Immersion track. I have tried. It took about five minutes for me.

    As for breaking the entrainment by changing a CD, I don't think that will happen since it almost automatic. If you have to get up and look for the CD though, you will likely need to entrain again.

    This is kind of like moving your legs or scratching while you meditate. You can do that once in a while without having to start over. But if you get up and go to the bathroom for instance, or answer the door, you will un-entrain completely.
     
  13. Grey

    Grey Member

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    frequencies?

    is there a solution to the question of frequencies? itlandm referred to the bands of alpha and delta and such but not to the frequency numbers. if freedomguru wants to match frequencies of holosync to life flow what are the holosync frequencies?
     
  14. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    Short answer: You cannot match them, because Holosync uses 4 different frequencies each day and LifeFlow uses 1. Matching them would be like a girl going on a date with four guys. (Don't try this at home.)

    The problem is not that we don't have the numbers, it is that having them does not answer the question. LF is not a HS clone. It is a new approach, built from the bottom up to stand on its own.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2009
  15. seatrend8899

    seatrend8899 Member

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    Hey Itlandm,
    Your post ....


    Made me chuckle big time. Thanks for that. Hope you are with us for the long term as this entrainment stuff is long term. :):):)


    shine on

    jim
     
  16. Grey

    Grey Member

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    thanks itlandm i think i understand. they do not mix well so not to waste a lot of time trying. for curiosity what are the frequencies? you say the dive program has an alpha a theta and a delta. what frequencies in alpha and theta and delta are used or is that information not given?
     
  17. Itlandm

    Itlandm Member

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    At the levels after Prologue there are actually several delta frequencies, starting with 2 Hz just after you get a new level, then over the course of the level you go down to 1.5, 0.5 and finally 0.3 Hz. When you move to a lower carrier frequency, you start back at 2 Hz for the target frequency again. This process repeats over many years.

    Holosync uses 10 Hz for alpha and 8 Hz for theta, but the Dive does not simply spend ten minutes on each of these as you would think, but slides downward through a range of frequencies, too numerous to count. The effectiveness of this approach is disputed. It creates some kind of effect (sometimes described as a buzz) but it is not traditional entrainment such as they use for delta. You may want to use their optional tracks if you want to entrain to alpha (Quietude) or high theta/low alpha (Oasis).
     

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