I was aware of the thought arising

Karmoh · September 16th, 2011, 00:13

While meditating this morning I was doing my usual follow the breath, observing my thoughts practice and wonderfully liberating it is too, when something happened, a very simple realisation. Normally observing my thoughts I have taken that to be when and image or as Eckhart Tolle eloquently puts it “the voice in the head” appears and wants my attention, but this morning. Three things happened

The appearance of images or voice commentary
The awareness of these – my true self watching
But here is the confusing thing, there was something else!

I was aware of the thought before it was a thought. Geez this hard to explain!

It was like a formless shape (oxymoron I know but I cannot say it another way) arising out of somewhere, my awareness touched it and then the thought took shape with the commentator in my head interpreting the formless shape then turning it in to an image or voice.

I was aware of the thought arising before I was aware that it was a thought.

WOW!

Does that make sense?

peace

Midnight · September 16th, 2011, 01:17

Yes I have experienced the same thing as well. You know what you're thinking before the thought comes up.

I've heard people talk about how thoughts themselves are just noise...echoes if you will, of true intelligence. I've also heard people say that consciousness and this "true intelligence" are one in the same. Interesting.

olmate · September 16th, 2011, 01:26

Hi Karmoh,

I recall reading a scientific experiment recently where brain activity was tracked as part of the human reaction to a stimulus. The findings were puzzling but in effect, activity in the brain occurred six seconds prior to the reaction. What was even more astounding was that often the brain activity started before the stimulus was actually sent.

Thereafter the article followed a fairly detailed discussion from a quantum physics perspective on why this is so.

Maybe this is what you are experiencing...

Olmate

Karmoh · September 16th, 2011, 01:30

HI Guys,

Yes I was quite taken with this realisation and I’ll not try to dwell too much, nor go looking again, but it has certainly add another dimension to the journey

GilesC · September 16th, 2011, 21:05

Hi Karmoh,

Yes, I've experienced this too on occassions.
I sort of refer to it as the awareness of the seeds of thought, though I sort of feel it should be more described as being aware of being aware.

Hugs

Giles

Hazelkay · September 17th, 2011, 00:39

Hi all from Hazel back from not so sunny hols - but had a great time.

Have also experienced this Karmoh and also have had the peculiar experience of feeling the sensation of anger before the stimulus and when the stimulus came, the need to be angry was then not there as I was aware and in objective mode before it happened - very helpful for someone who used to have a somewhat short fuse

peace and joy
H

Bryan555 · September 17th, 2011, 03:46

Originally Posted by Hazelkay

Hi all from Hazel back from not so sunny hols - but had a great time.

Have also experienced this Karmoh and also have had the peculiar experience of feeling the sensation of anger before the stimulus and when the stimulus came, the need to be angry was then not there as I was aware and in objective mode before it happened - very helpful for someone who used to have a somewhat short fuse

peace and joy
H

Hi Hazel..

You have a short fuse? Hard to believe. I guess the meditation is working, hmmm?

Hazelkay · September 18th, 2011, 00:15

Hi Bryan

For those who knew me over 20 years ago, before I started to meditate, I think they would see a different person.

Actually, the traits are still there - the anger, the impatience, the irritability, the procrastination, the depression, the grief, the bitterness, etc etc.

They still arise unbidden, but very often now are recognised for the fleeting, sensation based phenomena that they are, observed and allowed to pass.

Just in case I come over as being a bit saintly

my awareness is not yet continuous and things do break through and find expression from time to time, but, thankfully, the extended temper tantrums and sulks are a thing of the past.

The meditation adventure is the greatest journey I have undertaken and coming to know and accept this mind/body phenomenon as it is the greatest gift. It allows the acceptance of others just as they are too.

peace and joy

H

Karmoh · September 18th, 2011, 00:30

Originally Posted by Hazelkay

Hi Bryan

For those who knew me over 20 years ago, before I started to meditate, I think they would see a different person.

Actually, the traits are still there - the anger, the impatience, the irritability, the procrastination, the depression, the grief, the bitterness, etc etc.

They still arise unbidden, but very often now are recognised for the fleeting, sensation based phenomena that they are, observed and allowed to pass.

Just in case I come over as being a bit saintly

my awareness is not yet continuous and things do break through and find expression from time to time, but, thankfully, the extended temper tantrums and sulks are a thing of the past.

The meditation adventure is the greatest journey I have undertaken and coming to know and accept this mind/body phenomenon as it is the greatest gift. It allows the acceptance of others just as they are too.

peace and joy

H

Hi Hazelkay,

So much of that rings true with me too. My marriage and relationships were plagued by jealousy, persistent anger and long sulky moods. Now I awake with a smile, listen and have the space to allow people to be.
And as you rightly say, It’s all still there, although not repressed, just allowed to appear and then dissipate.

peace

Michael David · September 19th, 2011, 04:08

Hello to all

I have been enjoying this thead and the exploration of perception that shifts with meditation. Recently during meditation I have noticed a separation of three sets of awareness. This starts as a heaviness or combination of body sensation, feeling emotional sense and thoughts or mood that go with it.

This then separates into three parts
1. allowing the sensation to be whatever it is,
2. the thoughts about the mood to be just thoughts and
3. a sense of watching from an objective viewpoint.

As "I" watch and allow what ever is there to be there I start to notice I am holding some tension usually around my mouth or face. As soon as I notice it I remember that it is not "me." As I choose to let the sensaton be as it is I can sense before anything else happens that some other "zone or formless shape of intuition" of awareness is present and I remember being in this "zone" before. And then without doing anything this "zone" spreads and the tense muscle sensation will disappear and be replaced by the pleasant feeling of a slight soft smile.

It seems similar to the awareness of thoughts before they occur a precursor that has awareness before the synapses of the mind connect into active thoughts. In a way it is like going to a baseball game and sitting far away from the batter. When the ball is hit you see it first and then you know there will be the additional stinulus of a sound, the crack of the bat. So you can be ready for it and be more objective with your response.

I have noticed the same precursor when I stub a toe and catch my response before all of the old patterns of reaction (prior to meditation practice) flow in. I know if I go down that path I will get mad and kick the door. When the pain and surprise stimulate the bodies neurochemical response I sense that the anger or fustration will also arise before the stimulus of the neurochemitry kicks in. I can be more objective with a my response and not add insult to injury.

It seems that the "watcher" is always instantly watching even if I am not. The time it takes for the stimulus to go through its pathways and get to my conscious awareness may be the space that Karmoh and the rest of us described as having the sense of a thought before the thought occurs.

Well maybe or not. For some reason I just enjoy trying to surmise how these phenomena may occur.

Michael