I am trying

[walmalatian]

Yes, I am trying... I guess my mind has been too busy for many years but I will get there.
Can I change the mantra I picked at the very begining?

[Bhavya]

You said: "Can I change the mantra I picked at the very begining?"

I just spent the weekend receiving a teaching by a Tibetan Buddhist who stressed the importance of choosing a "meditation object" and sticking with it. Given that you haven't been meditating recently it seems totally appropriate that you change your mantra to something that suits you now, but then I would stick with it so you don't lose the benefits that will definitely come from using it for some time.

By the way, there are lots of people with busy minds. If you can just watch the thoughts without getting caught up in them, you'll find that you'll make good progress. The tracks will help tremendously.

All the best

Bhavya

[walmalatian]

Thank you!
I guess it is so recent that I am not used to the mantra yet. Perhaps I should try harder.

[Edwin]

It's interesting to see how people can have different thoughts and ideas towards meditation

I am not sure if the tibetian Buddhist you describe has religious reasons to say it is important to stick to a certain mantra, or that he finds it working best, but I have switched mantra twice and switched from watching the breath ( used to do Zen before I discovered this site ) to mantra meditation and back and back again over a year's time, and am quite happy with the results.

From personal experience I would say: You could pick the word "Teapot" as a mantra, as long as it works, use it, otherwise, try something else !

However I could be doing something structurally wrong this way and that monk might be right all along

That wasn't usefull I guess... sorry about that !

[Bhavya]

What Tibetan Buddhism says is not in reference to "mantras" in particular. He was speaking about "meditational objects" in reference to developing concentration. There can be lots of ways to focus: looking at a candle, visualizing an image such as light, Christ or Buddha or some holy being you venerate, using a mantra, chanting etc. The advice is given because many people have trouble staying with the object they're focusing on, especially if it's a complex one like an image. Michael was wise when he put together his meditation course because he chose mantra as the means of focusing and I admit that perhaps I was unwise to bring in Tibetan Buddhism which is an extremely complex subject.

However, as far as using any old word to focus on I would say, yes, of course you can do that. Certain words carry vibrations that can be very helpful. The rishis of ancient India discovered mantras through very deep states of meditation. They first felt the vibrations of a mantra and then translated that vibration into sound (words). When we use such a mantra, we are saturating our being with that vibration until eventually we reach the level at which the initial discovery by the rishi was made. If we move from mantra to mantra, we have to start from the beginning again in that process. What does happen naturally is that when we develop depth in concentration, the mantra falls away and we're left in the silence.

Of course Tibetan Buddhism is an "ism" - a particular way of looking at the mind through the lens of religion. Still, I would say that it's the Buddhists who were the first psychologists! They've studied the mind and the world of phenomena by developing extraordinary states of being. They've walked this path that we've just got our first foot on and while I'm not a Buddhist myself, I do like to listen to wisdom that others have discovered through experience. I find that I can use what I find useful and leave the rest.

Finally there's another question which I'd like to post when I have a little more time, relating to the difference between the benefits of meditational serenity - the peace that comes from one pointed concentration such as you are enjoying, Edwin, and "insight" such as is mentioned in the Meditation manual that someone posted not so long ago. Its a big subject but worth exploring!

Bhavya

[bashmaki]

Edwin wrote: "From personal experience I would say: You could pick the word "Teapot" as a mantra, as long as it works, use it, otherwise, try something else !"


Hey,
I like tea . . . maybe . . .


Oh never mind!!

gus

[Edwin]

Originally Posted by Bhavya

What Tibetan Buddhism says is not in reference to "mantras" in particular. He was speaking about "meditational objects" in reference to developing concentration. There can be lots of ways to focus: looking at a candle, visualizing an image such as light, Christ or Buddha or some holy being you venerate, using a mantra, chanting etc. The advice is given because many people have trouble staying with the object they're focusing on, especially if it's a complex one like an image. Michael was wise when he put together his meditation course because he chose mantra as the means of focusing and I admit that perhaps I was unwise to bring in Tibetan Buddhism which is an extremely complex subject.

Looking back at my post I realised that in the timeframe that I had to type it, it may be a little blunt, or could be interpreted that way. Sorry for that Bhavya, it was in no way intended that way.

I didn't misread you there by the way, I just tried to focus on mantra's as that was what walmalatian was talking about. In fact, that was why I brought up "watching the breath".

However, as far as using any old word to focus on I would say, yes, of course you can do that. Certain words carry vibrations that can be very helpful. The rishis of ancient India discovered mantras through very deep states of meditation. They first felt the vibrations of a mantra and then translated that vibration into sound (words). When we use such a mantra, we are saturating our being with that vibration until eventually we reach the level at which the initial discovery by the rishi was made. If we move from mantra to mantra, we have to start from the beginning again in that process. What does happen naturally is that when we develop depth in concentration, the mantra falls away and we're left in the silence.

You are right, I had not thought about that aspect of mantra's yet. Since I usually say the mantra in my head, resonance seems quite useless, but it can be very benificiary to have sound resonate through your body by means of voice... Kind of a prehistoric LifeFlow in a way

Of course Tibetan Buddhism is an "ism" - a particular way of looking at the mind through the lens of religion. Still, I would say that it's the Buddhists who were the first psychologists! They've studied the mind and the world of phenomena by developing extraordinary states of being. They've walked this path that we've just got our first foot on and while I'm not a Buddhist myself, I do like to listen to wisdom that others have discovered through experience. I find that I can use what I find useful and leave the rest.

I agree on your view , in fact, that is the very reason why I chose Zen as a meditation form when I started, the Japanese form of Buddhism. I have high respect for Buddhism in general and all of its forms.

Finally there's another question which I'd like to post when I have a little more time, relating to the difference between the benefits of meditational serenity - the peace that comes from one pointed concentration such as you are enjoying, Edwin, and "insight" such as is mentioned in the Meditation manual that someone posted not so long ago. Its a big subject but worth exploring!

Bhavya

Aside one-pointed meditation I am currently experimenting with mindfullness, and I too am very interested in this topic. I can't wait for your post
And once more, sorry for being a bit blunt earlyer.

[Bhavya]

Edwin, there's no need to apologize. I was feeling bad myself, thinking that I'd been defensive in my response....wow, communication is such a delicate thing!

When you said "You are right, I had not thought about that aspect of mantra's yet. Since I usually say the mantra in my head, resonance seems quite useless, but it can be very benificiary to have sound resonate through your body by means of voice... Kind of a prehistoric LifeFlow in a way."

what I was actually meaning was that, even when the mantra is thought silently, it imbues our entire mind/body system with its vibration. I believe that's how sending healing or peace works... through the power of thought, further energized by feeling. When you think about it, it affects everything!

Wishing you a splendid day Edwin, with success in all your endeavours,

Bhavya

BTW, I think you really are quite a 'bright light' - very positive - and I think everyone in this forum appreciates that!

[Edwin]

Originally Posted by Bhavya

Edwin, there's no need to apologize. I was feeling bad myself, thinking that I'd been defensive in my response....wow, communication is such a delicate thing!

When you said "You are right, I had not thought about that aspect of mantra's yet. Since I usually say the mantra in my head, resonance seems quite useless, but it can be very benificiary to have sound resonate through your body by means of voice... Kind of a prehistoric LifeFlow in a way."

what I was actually meaning was that, even when the mantra is thought silently, it imbues our entire mind/body system with its vibration. I believe that's how sending healing or peace works... through the power of thought, further energized by feeling. When you think about it, it affects everything!

Wishing you a splendid day Edwin, with success in all your endeavours,

Bhavya

BTW, I think you really are quite a 'bright light' - very positive - and I think everyone in this forum appreciates that!

Usually words travel between people accompanied by heart, and people can read between the lines. Sometimes on one or both sides the doors of the heart can be closed a little, making the words come across, with less heart. I am glad that there is nothing standing in between us, you are right, communication is delicate.

Since I don't have much experience with mantra's, I have not (yet) experienced this vibration through silently reciting them in my head. Can you give me an example of one of those mantra's ? It sounds interesting !

Oh and thanks for your kind words, I think they apply just as well on you

[sa1983ad]

Concerning my meditation, I just focus on the inner body energy as Eckhart Tolle said in practicing the power of now and it works for me. I can now watch my thoughts and feel the calm inside. I hope you all peace and love From SAAD.